Grumpy Old Granny-An eBay Seller's Nightmare!

This is not a typical flame in that I didn't get it because of my page, but because of a transaction on eBay. I sell stuff a lot as well as buy it and I have rarely had trouble, until now. This person who won a Sailor Moon toy auction I ran is by far the most obnoxious and downright psychotic buyer I've ever had the displeasure of dealing with. It started when I sent her the email confirming that she won the auction and to send a money order within 10 days to me at my address. Pretty standard stuff, and it was the exact same thing on my auction page, which also said that bidders with feedback lower than 50 had to send a money order/cashier's check as payment and within 10 days or appropriate feedback would be left, and that there were no exceptions unless prior arrangements were made. If you've ever dealt on eBay then you'd know that's a pretty standard kind of deal.

Well apparently Granny (which is what I shall call her since I don't want to be slanderous and use her real name here) didn't think so. She emails me back a day or two later and tells me that "payment will be in the form of a check". Now my initial reaction to this was annoyance. I mean, can she not read? So I reply to her stating clearly that I need a money order because her feedback was unacceptable for the check, and that if she sends me one I will send it back and leave negative feedback, or if she doesn't meet the deadline because of that I will do it. Harsh perhaps but I have had more than my fair share of flaky bidders, so I wanted to lay the terms out clearly from the beginning. Days pass and I hear nothing, and receive no payment. The 10-day period ends and still no changes. So I email her and warn her that if I don't hear from her in 24 hours I will leave her a negative feedback. I get no response, so I do what anyone would have done, I left the negative.

A day or so later I get an email from her saying that she was delayed because she's disabled and can't leave the house to get a money order, so she had to get someone to get it for her. Now at this point, I was mad. I have plenty of sympathy for those with disabilites, but she waited until well after the auction payment deadline was over to tell me. Had she told me that in the beginning I would have understood and made an exception, but it was clear at this point that she was using it as an excuse for her lack of following through. Hence I told her in an email response that I had already relisted the items since her deadline was past and I never got payment, and that I would send her payment back if and when it arrived.

A few days after THAT she leaves me a very rude negative feedback, and responds to mine in her profile saying that I'm rude and a liar and that I stole her money--money I never even received! Now I took great offense to that, because I have never cheated anyone and I am a very honest person. Over 140 on eBay had attested to just that fact before she left that rude little comment and I have gotten further positive remarks since despite her. So needless to say I had no intention of simply letting her get away with trying to slander me, and I commented as such on the feedback profile. That's when the antagonistic email started coming in. Here's the first:

Note: Real names and email addresses have been changed, out of respect to this person's privacy, even if she doesn't deserve it. I don't want to sink to her level, just vent about what an idiot she is.

Subj: I hope
Date: 8/20/99 1:59:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: notgrannysrealaddy@falseID.com (Disgruntled Grandma)
To: cheeezey@aol.com, GrannysRealUserID

I hope that all disabled persons contact me about you, you threatened negative feedback simply because I made the mistake of not noticing that you only took money orders, you simply could have politely emailed me regarding the fact and I would have done everything I could to make sure that I got someone to get a money order for me. I pray you are never housebound and without support so that you don't know how helpless one can feel.

I have the copy of the money order I have sent you, and my son, who is a lawyer says, since we have your name address, you can be contacted if we don't receive the material.

I also find it suspicious that you don't accept checks not because you have been hurt by people bouncing them but because your account is out of state? Maybe you just can't open one, I have heard of those kinds of deals.

Anyway, I will just be pleased to be done with you and be glad to see the stuff get here so that I can give it to my grandchildren.. I have kept everyone of your emails and printed them and I will mail and or forward them to anyone who asks me and they will agree to threaten negative feedback and then to carry it out even though someone was appraised of the situation isn't only unethical but unkind.

Since I am a decent person, here is the money order# 93785683134 .

My granddaughter says to tell you I am using her lap top thats why the address is different, I don't quite understand, but I will do what she says.

I hope you will be forgiven for your rudeness, you seem a very angry person

GrannysRealUserID

And here was my reply:

Subj: Re: I hope
Date: 8/20/99
To: notgrannysrealaddy@falseID.com, GrannysRealUserID

In a message dated 8/20/99 1:59:36 PM Eastern Daylight Time, notgrannysrealaddy@falseID.com writes:

> I hope that all disabled persons contact me about you, you threatened
> negative feedback simply
> because I made the mistake of not noticing that you only took money
> orders

I can understand a mistake, but I said it in both my auction page *and* in the confirmation email to you, which I do also have a copy of. I never received any money from you. I told you if I did that I would return it, and I meant it. I have never lied or cheated to anyone, my feedback speaks for itself.

I'm sorry that your disability hindered your ability to participate in this auction, but quite honestly that is not my problem. eBay is business. I stated that I wanted payment in ten days, because my objective is to make money from the items I sell. If you couldn't abide by those terms you shouldn't have bid. I lose money when people don't pay me and pay me on time. Secondly I never got the seven emails you claimed you sent, only a few (either two or three, I can't remember off hand).

> you simply could have
> politely emailed me regarding the fact and I would have done everything
> I could to make sure
> that I got someone to get a money order for me.

I did email you with a warning after your ten days were up, stating that I wanted payment within 24 hours. I could have left you a negative then and there with no warning, but I tried to be fair. You blew that chance by not responding by email, or sending your payment in a method that would ensure it got here on time.

> I pray you are never
> housebound and without
> support so that you don't know how helpless one can feel.

Again, I'm sorry to hear about your dilemma, but it's not my problem that you could not pay on time. By the time you told me what the delay was, I had already relisted the item, because I never received payment or heard further communication over email to indicate that you did intend to follow through. I told you in my response to that it was too late and the item was relisted, and that if I did receive some payment from you it would be returned.

> I have the copy of the money order I have sent you, and my son, who is a
> lawyer says, since
> we have your name address, you can be contacted if we don't receive the
> material.

I'm not afraid of contact because I have done nothing wrong. I took no money from you. Don't threaten me. I don't appreciate it when you were the one who didn't follow through with your bid.

> I also find it suspicious that you don't accept checks not because you
> have been hurt
> by people bouncing them but because your account is out of state?

I have never had someone bouncing a check on me, but my bank told me that they will charge me a fee if it does. Why should I risk that, when dealing with total strangers over the internet, when a money order is so much simpler? And though it's none of your business why I have an account out of state, I'll tell you why: I'm only 23 years old and until last November I lived with my mother in NJ. She created a joint account with me when I was in college three years ago in the credit union where she works, and I haven't changed it yet, because they have good rates and I have no reason to change it, even though I now live in NY. Other than having to mail in eBay deposits or give them to my mother to deposit for me, it's easy enough that I don't want to change it.

> Maybe
> you just can't open
> one, I have heard of those kinds of deals.

You know nothing about me or my credit history, so you (who didn't pay me as far as I know, since I have no payment) have some nerve making accusations and assumptions.

> Anyway, I will just be pleased to be done with you and be glad to see
> the stuff get here so
> that I can give it to my grandchildren.. I have kept everyone of your
> emails and printed them
> and I will mail and or forward them to anyone who asks me and they will
> agree to threaten
> negative feedback and then to carry it out even though someone was
> appraised of the
> situation isn't only unethical but unkind.

Soliciting negative feedback for others who haven't dealt with me is against eBay rules and regulations. I suggest you don't do that. So far you're the only one who's had a problem with me, so perhaps you should think about that. I have been nothing but fair to you. All my terms were clear from the beginning. It was you who misunderstood and didn't abide by them.

> Since I am a decent person, here is the money order#
> 93785683134 .

I will keep that record, and like I said, should I get it, it will be returned. You will not get the items because they have been relisted, as was stated in my email and my terms.

> My granddaughter says to tell you I am using her lap top thats why the
> address is different, I don't
> quite understand, but I will do what she says.
>
> I hope you will be forgiven for your rudeness, you seem a very angry
> person
>
> GrannysRealUserID

I'm angry because someone unjustly attempted to harm my reputation when I have never been anything but honest in every dealing I've made on eBay.

Tracy

Less than an hour later (funny how all email before this it took her DAYS to respond to, eh?) she sent back this reply, even more psychotic. Note how quickly she covers her ass when I caught her in her threat to have me feedback bombed. She's lucky this was sent when it was, because I was in the process of forwarding that last email to safeharbor@ebay.com for her off the wall threats to have people leave me more unjustified negative feedback.

Subj: Re: I hope
Date: 8/20/99 2:49:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: notgrannysrealaddy@falseID.com (Disgruntled Grandma)
Reply-to: notgrannysrealaddy@falseID.com (Disgruntled Grandma)
To: Cheeezey@aol.com
CC: notgrannysrealaddy@falseID.com, GrannysRealUserID

Oh my, I would never solicit anyone to send negative feedback regarding you, but I would be more than happy to express to anyone who has a questions of dealing with me that you BUSINESS practices are at the very least, suspicious. Just because I do not have over a hundred comments as you do, does not mean that I do not care about my dealings an a member of the ebay community.

On Fri, 20 Aug 1999 Cheeezey@aol.com wrote:

******* I have over 7 emails from YOU, THE SECOND ONE THREATING ME WITH NEGATIVE FEEDBACK, READ THAT ONE OVER AND DECIDE IF IT WAS VERY RUDE AND DEMANDING WHEN ANOTHER ONE WOULD HAVE DONE AS WELL, I HAVE BOTH COPIES OF ALL THE EMAILS I SENT YOU AND OF THE EMAILS THAT YOU SENT ME

******* I RESPONDED TO ALL OF YOUR EMAILS, INDICATING HOW PAYMENT WAS SENT

***** THIS WASN'T A THREAT, IT WAS A PROMISE, YOU WILL HAVE IN YOUR HANDS A MONEY ORDER FROM ME MADE OUT TO YOU, WHAT GOOD WOULD THAT DO ME IF YOU SEND IT BACK TO ME? I CAN'T CASH IT, I CAN'T USE IT SO WHAT GOOD WILL IT DO ME, IN OTHER WORDS, THATS WHY I DON'T SEND MONEY ORDERS BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE YOU CAN CASH THEM OR MISUSE THEM AND THEN I AM OUT THE MONEY BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY TO GET IT BACK

***** WELL, I SUGGEST THAT YOU GET IN LINE WITH 90% OF THE OTHER PEOPLE ON EBAY WHO UNDERSTAND THAT A CHECK IS LEGAL TENDER, AND ACCORDING TO MY SON, IF SOMEONE DOES BOUNCE A CHECK AGAINST YOU, THEN IT IS CONSIDERED FRAUD AND THEN YOU HAVE LEGAL RECOURSE..

**** AGAIN, I WILL NOT ASK ANYONE TO ENTER NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT YOU, BUT IF SOMEONE ASKES ME WHY YOU HAVE ENTERED ONE, EVEN THOUGH EVERYONE ELSES IS GLOWING, I WILL BE GLAD TO LET THEM KNOW MY SIDE OF THE STORY. PERHAPS EVERYONE ELSE HAS LEFT GOOD FEEDBACK ABOUT YOU BECAUSE THEY WERE AWARE FROM YOUR EMAILS, THAT YOU WOULD THREATEN THEM AND THEN CARRY THE THREAT OUT AND THEY WERE CONCERENED AS I AM THAT MY REPUTATION IS IMPUNGED !!!

<yup, you guessed it, more snipping>

********** WELL, YOU BETTER SEND A MONEY ORDER BACK TO IN MY NAME, BECAUSE I CERTAINLY CAN'T CASH THE ONE WITH YOUR NAME ON IT, AND I CERTAINLY DON'T WANT A CHECK FROM YOU, SINCE THAT WOULD BE AN OUT OF STATE CHECK FOR ME AND GOODNESS, IT COULD BOUNCE !!!!

### I TOO AM ANGRY BECAUSE SOMEONE UNJUSTLY ATTEMPTED TO HARM MY REPUTATION WHEN I HAVE NEVER BEEN ANYTHING BUT HONEST IN EVERY DEALING I'VE MADE ON EBAY.

YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE THOUGHT IT WAS SO REMARKABLE THAT I RESPONDED TO YOUR ACCUSATIONS, DO YOU THINK ANYONE WOULD ACCEPT A NEGATIVE FEEDBACK WITHOUT A MURMUR?

AGAIN, MY PHYSICAL PROBLEMS ARE NOT YOURS, BUT YOU ARE THE WORST KIND OF SELLER I HAVE EVER RUN INTO... I THINK THIS IS A PERFECT WAY FOR SOMEONE LIKE YOU TO MAKE MONEY OFF OF OTHERS. I AM AT FAULT BECAUSE I DID NOT NOTICE THAT YOU ONLY TOOK MONEY ORDERS, BUT THAT IS AS FAR AS I WILL GO. IF YOU CHOOSE TO LEAVE NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT ME, THEN I INTEND TO RESPOND AND INTEND TO TELL EVERYONE WHO CONTACTS ME ABOUT YOUR DUBIOUS "BUSINESS" PRACTICES ON EBAY. EBAY IS ALSO A COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE DEALING WITH OTHER PEOPLE, AND UNTIL PROVEN DIFFERENTLY, SHOULD BE TREATED WITH RESPECT AND FAIRNESS.

I WONDER IF THE IRS KNOWS EVERYONE CONSIDERS EBAY A BUSINESS RATHER THAN PEOPLE JUST SELLING AN ODD ITEM NOW AND THEN.

GRANNYSIDINALLCAPSLIKETHEREST

And here is my response to Granny's second email:

Subj: Re: I hope
Date: 8/21/99
To: notgrannysrealaddy@fakeID.com, GrannysRealUserID

In a message dated 8/20/99 2:49:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, notgrannysrealaddy@fakeID.com writes:

> Oh my, I would never solicit anyone to send negative feedback regarding
> you, but I would be more than happy to express to anyone who has a
> questions of dealing with me that you BUSINESS practices are at the very
> least, suspicious. Just because I do not have over a hundred comments
> as you do, does not mean that I do not care about my dealings an a member
> of the ebay community.

I find it rather disturbing that one who does not pay a high bid on time and then demands I send packages anyway has no ground to be calling me suspicous. If you did send a payment as you claim, I have yet to receive it, which would indicate that you sent it after the deadline, in which case the transaction was already null and void, and therefore I would return the payment to you upon receipt.

> ******* I have over 7 emails from YOU, THE SECOND ONE THREATING ME WITH
> NEGATIVE FEEDBACK, READ THAT ONE OVER AND DECIDE IF IT WAS VERY RUDE AND
> DEMANDING WHEN ANOTHER ONE WOULD HAVE DONE AS WELL, I HAVE BOTH COPIES OF
> ALL THE EMAILS I SENT YOU AND OF THE EMAILS THAT YOU SENT ME

I know what email that was and I know what I said. The "threat" of negative feedback was merely telling you that if you did not abide by the terms I set forth in my auction, namely (and I quote from the auction page visible at http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=138551280 )

"Payment is to be in the form of money order/cashier's check or cash (at buyer's own risk) only unless feedback is 50+ w/ no negatives for non-payment. Payment is due within 10 days of auction end, no exceptions unless prior arrangements are made. Appropriate feedback will be left so please don't bid if you don't intend to buy."

By placing your bid you entered into a legal contract agreeing to abide by the seller's terms and conditions. If you found my terms unfair or unreasonable then you should not have bid in the first place, and you have only your to blame for the negative remark you received for your failure to comply with them. Your excuse that you misunderstood is not my concern. You should have read the terms more carefully before you agreed to the legal binding contract of the bid. I was perfectly within my rights to tell you that I would leave you a negative feedback if you did not pay by money order or if I did not receive your payment within ten days. Since your payment did not arrive on time, you did not honor your part of the contract and I have chosen to void it because of your noncompliance. I have told you that if your payment arrives, that it will be returned to you via priority certified mail so that you will get it in a timely fashion.

> ******* I RESPONDED TO ALL OF YOUR EMAILS, INDICATING HOW
>PAYMENT WAS SENT

I did not get responses to your emails in a timely fashion. It is clear that you are a novice in eBay dealings... days elapsed between my emails to you and your responses. You also responded to my confirmation email saying "Payment will be in the form of a check." when I clearly stated I wanted a money order. That statement indicated you had not read and understood my terms, and I wanted to be clear on how I wanted my payment. If you had explained your dilemma in getting a money order in that email I would not have been so harsh, but you did not even explain why I didn't get that money order until after your payment deadline (which was August 12, 10 days after the auction ended August 2) had passed. That is hardly "arrangements in advance". I had no indication that you intended to follow through on your bid, especially when I did not get a response within 24 hours to the warning email, so therefore I refused to make an exception for you and left you a negative feedback.

> ***** THIS WASN'T A THREAT, IT WAS A PROMISE, YOU WILL HAVE IN YOUR HANDS
> A MONEY ORDER FROM ME MADE OUT TO YOU, WHAT GOOD WOULD THAT DO ME IF
> YOU SEND IT BACK TO ME? I CAN'T CASH IT, I CAN'T USE IT SO WHAT GOOD WILL
> IT DO ME, IN OTHER WORDS, THATS WHY I DON'T SEND MONEY ORDERS BECAUSE
> PEOPLE LIKE YOU CAN CASH THEM OR MISUSE THEM AND THEN I AM OUT THE MONEY
> BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY TO GET IT BACK

Any reputable money order dealer will give you a refund if you take it to them and it has not been endorsed or cashed.

> ***** WELL, I SUGGEST THAT YOU GET IN LINE WITH 90% OF THE OTHER PEOPLE ON
> EBAY WHO UNDERSTAND THAT A CHECK IS LEGAL TENDER, AND ACCORDING TO MY SON,
> IF SOMEONE DOES BOUNCE A CHECK AGAINST YOU, THEN IT IS CONSIDERED FRAUD
> AND THEN YOU HAVE LEGAL RECOURSE..

I don't care if every seller on eBay but me accepts checks. I don't, and I will not be bullied into accepting one from a buyer who thinks I should because the buyer finds money orders "inconvenient". Nowhere in the eBay policies does it say I have to accept a payment other than what I outlined as acceptable in my auction terms. If you did not agree with this then you should have read the terms more carefully before you placed a bid on my auction.

> **** AGAIN, I WILL NOT ASK ANYONE TO ENTER NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT YOU,
> BUT IF SOMEONE ASKES ME WHY YOU HAVE ENTERED ONE, EVEN THOUGH EVERYONE
> ELSES IS GLOWING, I WILL BE GLAD TO LET THEM KNOW MY SIDE OF THE STORY.
> PERHAPS EVERYONE ELSE HAS LEFT GOOD FEEDBACK ABOUT YOU BECAUSE THEY WERE
> AWARE FROM YOUR EMAILS, THAT YOU WOULD THREATEN THEM AND THEN CARRY THE
> THREAT OUT AND THEY WERE CONCERENED AS I AM THAT MY REPUTATION IS
> IMPUNGED !!!

You have only yourself and your poor conduct to blame for any damage to your reputation. It is the bidder's responsibility to honor the seller's conditions if they place the bid. I have my glowing feedback record because I treated every seller/bidder I dealt with fairly. Every time I have purchased I have gone out of my way to see that the seller's terms were met and met promptly and I kept in close email contact with them. I have also mailed every package that was paid for by a bidder in a timely fashion and that is why they are pleased to leave positive remarks about me. Remarks like the ones you just made only make it clearer that you don't understand how people generally conduct themselves on eBay. I have only left warnings and negative feedback to those who failed to abide by the terms of auctions they legally agreed to.

> WELL, YOU BETTER SEND A MONEY ORDER BACK TO IN MY NAME, BECAUSE I
> CERTAINLY CAN'T CASH THE ONE WITH YOUR NAME ON IT, AND I CERTAINLY
> DON'T WANT A CHECK FROM YOU, SINCE THAT WOULD BE AN OUT OF STATE CHECK FOR
> ME AND GOODNESS, IT COULD BOUNCE !!!!

If indeed you did send a payment and I receive it, your money will be returned.

> I TOO AM ANGRY BECAUSE SOMEONE UNJUSTLY ATTEMPTED TO HARM MY REPUTATION
> WHEN I HAVE NEVER BEEN ANYTHING BUT HONEST IN EVERY DEALING I'VE MADE ON
> EBAY.
>
> YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE THOUGHT IT WAS SO REMARKABLE THAT I RESPONDED TO
> YOUR ACCUSATIONS, DO YOU THINK ANYONE WOULD ACCEPT A NEGATIVE FEEDBACK
> WITHOUT A MURMUR?

Yes, as a matter of fact I did. You were the one who violated a contract and as such you should be mature enough to realize that and accept that your behavior was at best irresponsible and poorly handled.

> AGAIN, MY PHYSICAL PROBLEMS ARE NOT YOURS, BUT YOU ARE THE WORST KIND OF
> SELLER I HAVE EVER RUN INTO... I THINK THIS IS A PERFECT WAY FOR SOMEONE
> LIKE YOU TO MAKE MONEY OFF OF OTHERS.

Make money? I have lost money on you-- I did not get your payment! The moment that auction ended eBay charged me an ending fee for an auction on which the high bidder failed to come through. It is bidders like you that do not pay on time that make sellers weary of selling on eBay and who force us to have strict and harsh terms like the ones I have.

> I AM AT FAULT BECAUSE I DID NOT
> NOTICE THAT YOU ONLY TOOK MONEY ORDERS, BUT THAT IS AS FAR AS I WILL GO.
> IF YOU CHOOSE TO LEAVE NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ABOUT ME, THEN I INTEND TO
> RESPOND AND INTEND TO TELL EVERYONE WHO CONTACTS ME ABOUT YOUR DUBIOUS
> "BUSINESS" PRACTICES ON EBAY. EBAY IS ALSO A COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE DEALING
> WITH OTHER PEOPLE, AND UNTIL PROVEN DIFFERENTLY, SHOULD BE TREATED WITH
> RESPECT AND FAIRNESS.

Go right ahead, and if they don't have the objectivity to look past one person's viewpoint, then they are not the kind of person I would want to waste my time dealing with anyhow.

Cheeezey@aol.com

Think Granny's gone totally senile and insane too? Send all comments and/or MSTings to me at Cheeezey@yahoo.com.

Enough of this eBay bad bidder nonsense! Take me back to Flames, Rants, and Hatemail.